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Roam, notetaking ontology, and what software is for

8 tweets · June 2020 · 25 likes · 0 retweets · read on Twitter

Thoughts while reading this article by @danshipper about the notetaking cold war

Dan Shipper 📧 @danshipper ·

New 3,500 word Superorganizers essay: The Notetaking Cold War I dig into the philosophical roots of the battle between @fortelabs and @Conaw. It's member's only but you can read a long preview below. superorganizers.substack.com/p/the-notetaki…

> You’ll notice that there’s no great debate about the best way to organize the information inside of a CRM. It’s fairly obvious how to do that: a CRM should be a long list of customers. Nope! #roamcult actually thinks a CRM should also be intertwingled:

Kyle Harrison @kwharrison13 ·

@L1AD @deeeepka @azeem @RoamResearch @Conaw I use it as a personal CRM and it’s never been better because I can have people in context with my thoughts. As I’m reading an article I can just tag their name in a note I take and next time I’m on a call with them I have those in my side bar as talking points.

Hmm… looking at Essentialism ↔ Pragmatism debate… I would say the @RoamResearch side is better framed as "Relationalism" or "Contextualism" or something. It's taking more of an active stand than simply "instrumental value". Dan's description of P resonates with that:

> notice something really important about software: all software does the same thing. > Software lets us record information, store it, transform it, and then retrieve it at an appropriate point in the future. …not false, but this frame seems both too narrow & too abstract.

Like I find myself wanting to say "sure, technically, but that doesn't highlight the limitations nor possibilities of software compared to other tools or techniques. Tools are relational. They let us have certain kinds of experiences of ourselves while we're using it.

I find myself wanting to say "Roam is a notetaking app, but it is not a notes app". It doesn't have "notes". Its metaphor isn't totally clear (I've been musing about this) but it's clearly different from notes/notebook (essentially file/folder analog)

Conor @Conaw ·

14. The problem with existing notes systems is that they're locked into metaphors from when everything was analog. Files go in folders, and can get tags. At best, they add in the capacity for links to other files-- since links are now something everyone will be familiar with.

Hmm… yeah, some interesting stuff here about the nature of structure for a given type. Ontology. Is structure of information explicit & predefined, or implicit & emergent? Roam will powerfully queer that distinction. Talked w @Conaw last year about this.

Malcolm Ocean 🏴‍☠️ @Malcolm_Ocean ·

@context_ing @procrastiwork @visakanv @Conaw @micahtredding @andy_matuschak @Azeirah What I really want to have is a few really good editors for: - trees (workflowy!) - tables (airtable!) - prose (google docs!) - threads (twitter!) - ?? PLUS the ability to embed any of these anywhere within any of the others. Boom. #ThingsIWantToExist

Aaaaand I have hit the paywall. Hm, I'm curious to read the rest of this, but not $20 worth of curious. 🤷‍♀️